SEC Expansion

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Eric
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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby Eric » Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:35 am

So what if the SEC doesn't want them? They'll just go independent then? :lol:

I think it's against the rules for other conferences to actively recruit members from other conferences (right?), but obviously A&M wouldn't do this if they didn't have some confirmation that the SEC higher-ups had interest in them. I think it's unfortunate because the Big 12 is getting attacked from all sides and the Midwest is going to lose their football conference (it doesn't help that they're smack dab in the middle of the country either, so the SEC, Big 10, and Pac-12 can snipe off the members by expanding a little more to the west and east respectively).
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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby Dossenator » Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:44 am

Eric wrote:So what if the SEC doesn't want them? They'll just go independent then? :lol:

I think it's against the rules for other conferences to actively recruit members from other conferences (right?), but obviously A&M wouldn't do this if they didn't have some confirmation that the SEC higher-ups had interest in them. I think it's unfortunate because the Big 12 is getting attacked from all sides and the Midwest is going to lose their football conference (it doesn't help that they're smack dab in the middle of the country either, so the SEC, Big 10, and Pac-12 can snipe off the members by expanding a little more to the west and east respectively).


Texas A&M expressed interest in joining the SEC a few weeks ago. SEC officials met and turned them down. Many said it was not that they did not want them but the timing was not right (for legal purposes, etc). Them leaving the Big XII and following procedures, I am assuming, would make it easier for join the SEC. The other rumor was that they were turned down until the SEC could find a 14th school ready to commit to moving to the SEC (they do not want a league with an odd number of teams). Not sure what is going to happen.
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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby Eric » Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:47 pm

Right, they could work it out with 13 schools but the problem would be an unbalanced schedule. The MAC has worked with 13 teams since adding Temple, but even they went out and added UMass to even it up (I think that starts in 2013).
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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby Spence » Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:06 pm

I think ultimately they will come full circle. By going to 16 team divisions, they are really going back to eight team conferences.
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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby Cane from the Bend » Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:48 pm

Without personal speculation, or personal subjectivity; this is what people who are involved in this mess are actually saying.

Anything typed (within the parenthesis) is however my two bits thrown in. 8)

>

Texas A&M, said it will submit an application to join another, unspecified conference. If accepted, Texas A&M will leave the Big 12, effective June 30, 2012.

Texas A&M university President R. Bowen Loftin: "Leaving the Big 12 is in the best interest of Texas A&M," formally notifying the league with a letter after earlier securing details on the withdrawal process.

He said he hopes the move can be amicable and presumably hopes to negotiate a reasonable exit fee. (Nebraska paid $9.25 million and Colorado paid $6.9 million)

R. Bowen Loftin: "We are seeking to generate greater visibility nationwide for Texas A&M and our championship-caliber student-athletes, as well as secure the necessary and stable financial resources to support our athletic and academic programs. This is a 100-year decision that we have addressed carefully and methodically."

Texas A&M athletic director Bill Byrne said in a blog post Wednesday: "The departures of Nebraska and Colorado and the creation of the Longhorn Network made the Big 12 "considerably different" than it was last summer. There have also been other developments during the past several months that have caused a great deal of uncertainty within the Big 12. You all know the landscape of the Big 12 Conference was altered by the creation of the Longhorn Network."

He mentions the network's attempts to televise high school games and the "attempt to coerce Big 12 schools to move their football games in Austin" to the network. Byrne also said that Texas A&M was not offered the chance to join the Longhorns in the venture.

>

The Southeastern Conference said earlier this month it was happy with its current membership but left the door open to expansion, and the Aggies certainly wouldn't have made this move if they didn't believe they could eventually join the conference.

The Aggies would need the votes of nine of the 12 presidents from the member schools for the SEC to allow them into the league.

The SEC is now saying they would consider the possibility of a one year run with 13 teams, as long as there were a suitable 14th member ready to join the following year.

Presently, the SEC said it had not received an application from Texas A&M to join the league and that it would offer no further comment.

>

Sources within the Big 12 confirmed they would like to move as quickly as possible to replace Texas A&M.

The conference wants to add one school in the immediate sense, but has not ruled out the possibility of an additional three teams in the future.

Of course, much of the motivation to maintain the stability of the Big XII conference would be due to The Big 12's agreement to a 13-year television deal with Fox Sports in April, worth more than $1 billion, a contract that technically could be voided with Texas A&M's departure and lead to legal issues for the Aggies.

A person familiar with that TV deal told The Associated Press on Wednesday that the league has indications from the network that if a suitable replacement can be found that "they will be fine and keep the contract as is."

The person, speaking on condition of anonymity because the details are not supposed to be public, also said that the contract could remain in force at a discounted rate even if the Big 12 had only its remaining nine teams.

Open statements from Big Twelve officials, are;

Missouri chancellor Brady Deaton (who serves as the chairman of the Big 12 board of directors): "The chancellors and presidents of the Big 12 are committed to keeping our conference competitively and academically strong. We have a process in place that enables us to move aggressively regarding the possible expansion of the conference and to assure our members and student-athletes that we will take advantage of the most productive opportunities in the best interests of all."

Big 12 commissioner Dan Beebe: "The presidents and chancellors of the nine remaining member institutions are steadfast in their commitment to the Big 12. As previously stated, the conference will move forward aggressively exploring its membership options."

Texas athletic director DeLoss Dodds: "As we stated last summer, we are strong supporters and members of the Big 12 conference. Recent events have not altered our confidence in the league. A Big 12 committee is in place to look at all options, shaping the future of the conference so it will continue to be one of the top leagues in the country."

Baylor president Ken Starr: "We still believe the Big 12 has a bright future. We know that the Big 12 is an exciting and attractive conference for many reasons, including the quality of our academic programs, the strength of our athletic teams, the support of our loyal fans and the depth of our vibrant traditions."

The conference understands Notre Dame has no plans to join the Big 12 and that Arkansas is a "less than 50 percent shot," as one administrator said.
(though it is interesting these schools were mentioned as part of the conversation)

The Big 12 believes BYU would consider an invitation -- despite just declaring its independence in football -- because joining would ease scheduling concerns and provide more direct access to the BCS. And one administrator said the Big 12 does not have issues with BYU's policy of not playing on Sundays.

BYU associate athletic director Duff Tittle: "There is much speculation right now regarding conference affiliation that seems to change by the hour. Commenting on such conjecture is not productive and creates a distraction for our program. As we enter the 2011-12 athletic season, BYU is focused on the opportunities ahead. We are excited about our relationship with ESPN as a football independent and our affiliation with the West Coast Conference." (if you read into this statement; it is not a No)

Two administrators said it was unlikely the conference would add an in-state school such as TCU, SMU or Houston because it would not necessarily add television value and because the footprint of Texas is already covered.

And yet, the only school to publicly express interest in joining the Big 12 is SMU, while noting their climb back to respectability.

Also, an indefinite answer from Houston, with regards to the Universities contact with the Big 12.

Houston athletic director Mack Rhoades: "We're always going to look to get better, and look for opportunity. Whether that comes, whether that doesn't, I certainly can't answer that. But we're in a great conference right now, and we're going to continue to be a great member. But we're also going to do everything we can to get better."

Rhoades said he believes A&M's decision could be the first domino in changes across the landscape of college football.

Mack Rhoades: "Right now, let's face it, that's the world of college athletics. Whatever happens here in the next week, two weeks, three months, who knows what the timeline is? I don't think it ends there. I think it's going to continue to evolve over the next few years."

Pittsburgh and Louisville have also been discussed by a special committee on expansion as realistic possibilities, sources said. (which I might add, is the first I've heard talks of the Big XII's interest in moving eastward)

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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby Cane from the Bend » Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:14 am

If the Big 12 were to pluck up BYU, they wouldn't be infringing on anybody's alignment. However; if they were to move east, and scarf-up Pitt & Louisville to balance out a 6-6 two division setup, then, the Big East is looking like the new cherry picking tree.

I assumed Pitt would end up in the ACC. Now I suspect a possible USF - West Virgina move.

If Va Tech does jump ship, look for the ACC to replace 'em with either Cincinnati or TCU.

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Cane... [__]

"It is only impossible until it has been accomplished." ... then it becomes standardized ...

Success is measured by results; whereas Character is measured through the means by which one achieves those results . . .

It seems the Rapture did come for two worthy souls:
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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby donovan » Thu Sep 01, 2011 3:48 am

There are rumors that BYU has been in discussion with the B12 since A & M sold their birthright for a mess (of pottage?)

My belief is, BYU will be very slow in breaking commitments they made a year ago to WCC schools for other sports, they are not going to give up their ESPN BYU TV contract....ESPN was obviously OK with their being independent. My guess...they are all right with their Independence for sometime...(I also think they may come out of all of this better than most that are running around pushing like the bully at an Easter egg hunt pushing the little kids to the ground so they can get the eggs.)
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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby Vileborg » Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:14 am

I would think,

SEC grabs A&M, Wake Forrest, and Virginia. That adds three states to their coverage area. It's possible they could take a different Virginia or NC team but these seem like the best fits IMO.

Big 12 takes Louisville, BYU, and Cincy.

ACC then grabs West Virginia, Pitt, and maybe South Florida or East Carolina.


Wake and UVA have grand tradition and open up markets for the SEC. Wake would then have recruiting advantage over UNC, Duke, NC St., and ECU. UVA is getting their butt handed to them on the recruiting front in Virginia and I know they want to even the score.

I think its a death match for the Big 12 and the Big East. Once someone starts poaching either conference it could become a feeding frenzy. The longhorn network is such a deterrent it may cause the conference to fail. The big 12 could become the Big 1 and the little 2.(Texas, Texas Tech, SMU) I could see them poaching Louisville, Cincy and picking up BYU.

I'm thinking Pitt and Cincy could go either way but feel Pitt is more ACC. If the ACC loses a team and the Big East is floundering I could see them grabbing Pitt, WVU, and a third. UConn may be an option but I don't think Duke would want them. I don't think they want to expand to NY but if they did I think Syracuse could be a fit. They have 2 Florida teams and 4 NC teams so adding a third Florida team or replacing a fourth NC team doesn't seem outside the possibilities.

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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby billybud » Thu Sep 01, 2011 6:42 am

The chances that Wake Forest and Virginia leave for the SEC are nil, IMHO.

I think that the Carolina and Virginia schools (with their academic camaraderie as top ranked public universities) have no desire to be associated with the SEC.

Clemson and FSU are much more "SEC like" but neither would likely receive the necessary votes for inclusion. I really think that the ACC won't get raided and that, of all the available teams for the SEC, it will come down to Mizzou and WVU.
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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby Cane from the Bend » Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:50 am

Missouri seems to be touting the torch for the Big XII's survival right now. The only way Mizzou leaves, from my perspective, is if "other schools" within the conference continue showing resistance against potential replacements for the outbound.

In-that-case, Missouri would likely say, "forget, it we tried but you aren't sincere enough to keep this thing afloat".

I only listed Virginia Tech as a potential candidate in my previous, because that is the current buzz. However, Tech hasn't mentioned any interest in the SEC. (this may just be a whole-lotta media nothing, because it is what the press wants)

I have heard a proposal that the Big Twelve might take TCU.

Texas & Texas Tech may be able to block the induction of two outta the three candidates; Houston - SMU - TCU. Yet, they would probably be over stepping their bounds if they attempted omission of all 3.

The reports of the Big XII's interest in Pitt & Louisville were genuine, however. And if that were to take place, TCU may be prompted to follow suit.

It could push West Va into the SEC, though, their name has not come up in conversations . . . yet. (which is why I assume their interest would be joining with the ACC should the conference decide to expand to 14)

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Cane... [__]

"It is only impossible until it has been accomplished." ... then it becomes standardized ...

Success is measured by results; whereas Character is measured through the means by which one achieves those results . . .

It seems the Rapture did come for two worthy souls:
In Memory of Grandpa Howdy
In Memory of Donovan Davisson

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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby donovan » Thu Sep 01, 2011 11:44 am

The teams, I think, that have come out best in all of this musical chairs are:

Army
Navy
Notre Dame
BYU

The new contract with ESPN will pay BYU about the same amount each game that they were getting each season with The MTN and allow for greater freedom with their own channel.

None of these schools will have a problem filling up their schedules with good quality teams. Certainly better than if they were in the Big 12. These schools are truly independent schools in a lot of ways, not just football.
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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby Cane from the Bend » Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:19 pm

I agree; the benefits of conference affiliation are proving beneficial for the conferences themselves, and less substantiated for the schools.

The conferences are looking more like teamsters these days.
Pay your dues, and don't ask questions.
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Cane... [__]

"It is only impossible until it has been accomplished." ... then it becomes standardized ...

Success is measured by results; whereas Character is measured through the means by which one achieves those results . . .

It seems the Rapture did come for two worthy souls:
In Memory of Grandpa Howdy
In Memory of Donovan Davisson

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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby armchairqb » Fri Sep 02, 2011 10:59 am

I think the Big 12 is insane if they overlook the University of Houston.

From a TV market standpoint, it's as close as a replacement for Texas A&M as possible.

And unlike all of this recent talk about SMU wanting in the Big 12, the Mustangs can't draw more than 20,000 a game unless TCU is in town. UH, with a stadium capacity of 32000, sold out every home game except for one in 2010. A stadium expansion would not be fruitless if UH joined the Big 12.
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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby WoVeU » Fri Sep 02, 2011 11:16 am

armchairqb wrote:I think the Big 12 is insane if they overlook the University of Houston.

From a TV market standpoint, it's as close as a replacement for Texas A&M as possible.

And unlike all of this recent talk about SMU wanting in the Big 12, the Mustangs can't draw more than 20,000 a game unless TCU is in town. UH, with a stadium capacity of 32000, sold out every home game except for one in 2010. A stadium expansion would not be fruitless if UH joined the Big 12.



Absolutely agree! Houston should be a no-brainer!
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Re: SEC Expansion

Postby billybud » Fri Sep 02, 2011 1:06 pm

It's not "market" as such for ESPN...it's ratings. It is more who turns the dial nationally.

Temple doesn't deliver nor Rutgers nor Houston, in spite of their large metropolitan footprint. Now, Tuscaloosa delivers because people nationally watch the game.

If ESPN has to pony up extra dollars to make an expanded SEC viable, there is a cocommitant expectation of increased ratings.
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