BCS Rankings: TCU leaps Boise

[Cane from the Bend]

Direct analysis of payer positions = `09 - 10

Boise State Starting Line up `09:

Offense
QB Kellen Moore ( Soph )
RB Jeremy Avery ( Jr )
WR Tyler Shoemaker ( Soph )
WR Austin Pettis ( Jr )
WR Titus Young ( Jr )
TE Kyle Efaw ( Soph )
C Thomas Byrd ( Soph )
RG Kevin Sapien ( Jr )
LG Garrett Pendergast ( Soph )
RT Nate Potter ( Soph )
LT Matt Slater ( Jr )

Special Teams
K/P Kyle Brotzman ( Jr )

Defense
DE Ryan Winterswyk ( Jr )
DE Byron Hout ( Soph )
DT Billy Winn ( Soph )
DT Chase Baker ( Soph )
SLB Aaron Tevis ( Soph )
MLB Derrell Acrey ( Jr )
WLB Hunter White ( Soph )
CB Kyle Wilson ( Sr )
CB Brandyn Thompson ( Jr )
SS Jeron Johnson ( Jr )
FS George Iloka ( Soph )



Boise State Starting Line up 2010:


Offense
QB Kellen Moore ( Jr )
RB Jeremy Avery ( Sr )
WR Tyler Shoemaker ( Jr )
WR Austin Pettis ( Sr )
WR Titus Young ( Sr )
TE Kyle Efaw ( Jr )
C Thomas Byrd ( Jr )
RG Will Lawrence ( Sr )
LG Nater Potter ( Jr ) ( as noted: Potter & Pendergast switched positions )
RT Garrett Pendergast ( Jr )
LT Charles Leno ( rFresh ) ( Matt Slater ( Sr ) is now listed as 2cnd strng )

Special Teams
K/P Kyle Brotzman ( Sr )

Defense
DE Ryan Winterswyk ( Sr )
DE Shea McClellin ( Jr )
DT Billy Winn ( Jr )
NT Chase Baker ( Jr )
WLB Aaron Tevis ( Jr ) ( Hunter White ( Jr ) is now listed as 3rd strng )
MLB Daron Mackey ( Sr ) ( Derrell Acrey ( Jr ) listed 2cnd strng , Hunter White ( Jr ) listed 3rd
NB Winston Venable ( Sr )
CB Jamar Taylor ( Soph )
CB Brandyn Thompson ( Sr )
SS Jeron Johnson ( Sr )
FS George Iloka ( Jr )

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TCU Starting Line up `09:


Offense
QB Andy Dalton ( Jr )
RB Joseph Turner ( Sr )
WR Antoine Hicks ( Soph )
WR Jimmy Young ( Jr )
WR Bart Johnson ( Jr )
TE Evan Frosch ( Jr )
C Jake Kirkpatrick ( Jr )
RG Zach Roth ( Jr )
LG Kyle Dooley ( Soph )
RT Marcus Cannon ( Jr )
LT Marshall Newhouse ( Sr )

Special Teams
K Ross Evans ( Soph )
P Anson Kelton ( Soph )

Defense
DE Braylon Broughton ( Soph )
DE Jerry Hughes ( Sr )
DT Wayne Daniels ( Jr )
NT Kelly Griffin ( Jr )
SLB Daryl Washington ( Sr )
MLB Tanner Brock ( Fresh )
CB Rafael Priest ( Sr )
CB Nick Sanders ( Sr )
SS Marcus Jackson ( Sr )
WS Malcolm Williams ( Jr )
FS Tejay Johnson ( Jr )


TCU Starting Line up 2010:


Offense
QB Andy Dalton ( Sr )
RB Matthew Tucker ( Soph )
WR Antoine Hicks ( Jr )
WR Jimmy Young ( Sr )
WR Jeremy Kerley ( Sr ) ( Bart Johnson ( Sr ) is now listed as 2cnd strng )
TE Evan Frosch ( Sr )
C Jake Kirkpatrick ( Sr )
RG Josh Vernon ( Sr )
LG Kyle Dooley ( Jr )
RT John Woolridge (rFresh )
LT Marcus Cannon ( Sr ) ( previous RG Zach Roth ( Sr ) is listed as 2cnd strng )

Special Teams
K Ross Evans ( Jr )
P Anson Kelton ( Jr )

Defense
DE Braylon Broughton ( Jr )
DE Wayne Daniels ( Sr ) ( moved from DT )
DT Cory Grant ( Sr )
NT Kelly Griffin ( Sr )
SLB Tanner Brock ( Soph ) ( moved from Middle Line Backer )
MLB Tank Carder ( Jr )
CB Greg McCoy ( Jr )
CB Jason Teague ( Sr ) ( previous WS Malcolm Williams ( Sr ) listed as 2cnd strng )
SS Tyler Luttrell ( Sr )
WS Alex Ibiloye ( Sr )
FS Tejay Johnson ( Sr )


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It would seem that TCU had the most change over, with new defensive players.


However, in contrast;

The last team to beat TCU was Boise State ... 2009 season Fiesta Bowl
The last team to beat Boise State was TCU ... 2008 season Poinsettia Bowl

Also to note: if more games played can be a contributing factor, as mention in above replies, then a glance at Boise States schedule shows that Boise's 14 - 0 record saw them winning 13 regular season games last year, whereas Boise State plays 12 regular season games this year.

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You may draw on your own conclusions from this information , as, I seem to have to post that I am just relaying these facts, and do not denote any personal opinion from them.

If I do not type that previous line, a few sensitive members unjustifiably assume I am insinuating something I have not included.

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[Spence]

But even if you look at TCU's turnover, they are mostly Jr's turning into Seniors which means they were on last years team on the 2deep. So basically they are in the rotation. That doesn't necessarily mean they are worse then last year, but it generally means there isn't much difference between last years team and this years team. Both teams were young in 2008. Nothing you look at between Boise State and TCU last year to this year would lead you to believe that the teams are radically different. If they played again then it is likely it would be another fairly close game and both teams are evenly matched. In this case, if I am ranking teams, I give the nod to the team that won the earlier matchup. There is nothing, as far as I am concerned that could lead anyone to believe that makes TCU jump Boise State in the BCS - nothing legit anyway.

[Cane from the Bend]

In my opinion, the only factor that could be weighed is TCU playing Tennessee Tech in an OoC game.

To play an FCS team, when you are trying to prove you belong in the running for the Big title, should be an obvious no-no to whomever did the scheduling.

We have one game to compare these teams by... Oregon State.

The Beavers lost both games... so, in esse it tells us nothing.

Maybe TCU's game against Utah will give us a little more. Unless Utah wins.

Personally, I don't think TCU did anything special that justifies their jumping Boise State either... and I would think, the HornedFrogs playing vs Tennessee Tech should negate the effect of beating a Highly ranked Utah team... again, unless Utah wins.

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[Cane from the Bend]

Though, it might be interesting to note: the media has been heavily pushing TCU for a while now... so much so, that they are doing their part to see the hornedfrogs ranked ahead of Boise St.

It makes one wonder, why?

Maybe they know something we don't... such as, a possible move into the dissolvong Big 12.

That would leave one program slot open... but to who?

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[Spence]

I think both teams are very evenly matched. I don't think either has done anything to jump the other in the polls. There is no legit reason to jump one over the other. That is my opinion. What I know as fact is nine games ago when they played head to head Boise State won.

[RazorHawk]

I think both teams are very evenly matched. I don't think either has done anything to jump the other in the polls. There is no legit reason to jump one over the other. That is my opinion. What I know as fact is nine games ago when they played head to head Boise State won.

I am also in the camp, that the results of a game last year, even if both teams had the same exact players, should not be part of the equation. I think if and when TCU beats Utah, that should leapfrog the horned frogs ahead of the Broncos. I also think if Utah wins that game, they will also jump ahead of Boise State.

My feelings though, will have nothing to do with what happens.

On a different light, I do find it odd that 3 of the top five ranked teams in the BCS are not BCS schools.

[Spence]

I don't know why not. If they are both winning with basically the same teams, what is the justification? They are very even teams. If you originally thought TCU was a better team - OK. But ignoring the direct comparision makes no sense. It wasn't like they played two years ago or young players have matured. To use indirect comparisions and ingnore direct comparisions absolutely makes no sense to me.

[Cane from the Bend]

I agree, and disagree based on scheduling.

If Utah wins their game against TCU, yep, I'm right there... they should have the thumbs up; and I wouldn't have a problem with it.

If TCU beats Utah... nope, they did not prove themselves... and they did not try to.

After all is said and done, you cannot fault Boise for Virginia Tech's losing to an FCS team...

Utah, scheduled Pitt, Iowa St, and notre dame in their OoC gaming... just the same, Utah could not have predicted Pitt to be as substandard as they are, nor notre dame... and at least they put another BCS conference school on their schedule; even if the Cyclones are otherwise pitiful.

TCU scheduled Oregon St, Tennessee Tech, and Baylor in their OoC schedule.

Oregon St is a team TCU & Boise St have a mutual win over... that cancels.

Unless something goes terribly wrong for the Hokies at this point, Va Tech is a better win than Baylor.

That leaves Tennessee Tech and Toledo.

Yes, Boise States win against the Rockets isn't something to jump up and praise... however, it was a FBS school not an FCS.

TCU gets a giant thumbs down here... this is a no-brainer... if you are a non-qualifier school, you should not expect favoritism in the polls by scheduling a non-division team.

No good argument can be made here.

We ask Boise State to amp up their scheduling, and tell them it is not good enough, because we load them up with special conditions... because they are in a non-qualifier conference.

Then, when TCU comes a knockin', someone is willing to give them a pass... when they have deliberately avoided potential competition by scheduling an FCS school... Boise wouldn't even be in the conversation had they played Tennessee Tech, so why should TCU?

You can't give them that much credit for a yet to be played game versus Utah... and even then?

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[Spence]

I agree.

[billybud]

TCU played Oregon State, Baylor and Air Force and plays Utah....their schedule, even with Tennessee Tech, is not as weak as Boise's. And it's strength, not category, that counts in an SOS.

Tennessee Tech is ranked only a few places weaker than New Mexico State....they are, essentially the same in strength as an opponent. I'd much rather face the bottom five WAC teams than Jax State or William and Mary, who are rated as stronger.

[silverfox]

Well...the computers, just like us folks, saw Baylor beat Texas. The computers, like us folks, said "hmmm".

Lord Help in this place of conspricy theories!!!! Roswell, the grassy knoll, the computers helping G.W. twice!!! What happens if the WARRIORS beat the Broncos on the blue turf on saturday? Does that automatically jump us from nowhere to somewhere in the top 25 all the sudden? If so where? As far as computers go I get all giddy when I get something right on this one!!! I'll stop now and let ya'll sort it out.

It could happen. Hawaii is a very good team this year and leads the nation in the air. Boise's secondary has been sketchy, at best. While their Defense is outstanding and NCAA-rated, it will be a major test to try to contain Hawaii's air game.

The more I think about it the more I believe the BCS computers have factored in all wins to date which would explain a leapfrog. TCU has two more wins than Boise State. But by season end the games will be even and Boise State's conference opponents are stronger between now and than than TCU's (with a big question mark ? about Utah).

I also think Alabama and Arkansas were maligned by the computers in this last BCS poll.

[Dossenator]

Well...the computers, just like us folks, saw Baylor beat Texas. The computers, like us folks, said "hmmm".

Lord Help in this place of conspricy theories!!!! Roswell, the grassy knoll, the computers helping G.W. twice!!! What happens if the WARRIORS beat the Broncos on the blue turf on saturday? Does that automatically jump us from nowhere to somewhere in the top 25 all the sudden? If so where? As far as computers go I get all giddy when I get something right on this one!!! I'll stop now and let ya'll sort it out.

It could happen. Hawaii is a very good team this year and leads the nation in the air. Boise's secondary has been sketchy, at best. While their Defense is outstanding and NCAA-rated, it will be a major test to try to contain Hawaii's air game.

The more I think about it the more I believe the BCS computers have factored in all wins to date which would explain a leapfrog. TCU has two more wins than Boise State. But by season end the games will be even and Boise State's conference opponents are stronger between now and than than TCU's (with a big question mark ? about Utah).

I also think Alabama and Arkansas were maligned by the computers in this last BCS poll.

According to ESPN today Ark is #1 in passing offense in the nation with 360.4 yards passing a game. I agree TCU should not have jumped Boise, and I think Ark will move up the BCS polls if they continue to win (3 ranked teams left out of 4 games).

[Spence]

But do you believe that Arkansas should jump Auburn or Alabama if one or the other doesn't lose again?

[donovan]

Direct analysis of payer positions = `09 - 10

Boise State Starting Line up `09:

Offense
QB Kellen Moore ( Soph )
RB Jeremy Avery ( Jr )
WR Tyler Shoemaker ( Soph )
WR Austin Pettis ( Jr )
WR Titus Young ( Jr )
TE Kyle Efaw ( Soph )
C Thomas Byrd ( Soph )
RG Kevin Sapien ( Jr )
LG Garrett Pendergast ( Soph )
RT Nate Potter ( Soph )
LT Matt Slater ( Jr )

Special Teams
K/P Kyle Brotzman ( Jr )

Defense
DE Ryan Winterswyk ( Jr )
DE Byron Hout ( Soph )
DT Billy Winn ( Soph )
DT Chase Baker ( Soph )
SLB Aaron Tevis ( Soph )
MLB Derrell Acrey ( Jr )
WLB Hunter White ( Soph )
CB Kyle Wilson ( Sr )
CB Brandyn Thompson ( Jr )
SS Jeron Johnson ( Jr )
FS George Iloka ( Soph )



Boise State Starting Line up 2010:


Offense
QB Kellen Moore ( Jr )
RB Jeremy Avery ( Sr )
WR Tyler Shoemaker ( Jr )
WR Austin Pettis ( Sr )
WR Titus Young ( Sr )
TE Kyle Efaw ( Jr )
C Thomas Byrd ( Jr )
RG Will Lawrence ( Sr )
LG Nater Potter ( Jr ) ( as noted: Potter & Pendergast switched positions )
RT Garrett Pendergast ( Jr )
LT Charles Leno ( rFresh ) ( Matt Slater ( Sr ) is now listed as 2cnd strng )

Special Teams
K/P Kyle Brotzman ( Sr )

Defense
DE Ryan Winterswyk ( Sr )
DE Shea McClellin ( Jr )
DT Billy Winn ( Jr )
NT Chase Baker ( Jr )
WLB Aaron Tevis ( Jr ) ( Hunter White ( Jr ) is now listed as 3rd strng )
MLB Daron Mackey ( Sr ) ( Derrell Acrey ( Jr ) listed 2cnd strng , Hunter White ( Jr ) listed 3rd
NB Winston Venable ( Sr )
CB Jamar Taylor ( Soph )
CB Brandyn Thompson ( Sr )
SS Jeron Johnson ( Sr )
FS George Iloka ( Jr )

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TCU Starting Line up `09:


Offense
QB Andy Dalton ( Jr )
RB Joseph Turner ( Sr )
WR Antoine Hicks ( Soph )
WR Jimmy Young ( Jr )
WR Bart Johnson ( Jr )
TE Evan Frosch ( Jr )
C Jake Kirkpatrick ( Jr )
RG Zach Roth ( Jr )
LG Kyle Dooley ( Soph )
RT Marcus Cannon ( Jr )
LT Marshall Newhouse ( Sr )

Special Teams
K Ross Evans ( Soph )
P Anson Kelton ( Soph )

Defense
DE Braylon Broughton ( Soph )
DE Jerry Hughes ( Sr )
DT Wayne Daniels ( Jr )
NT Kelly Griffin ( Jr )
SLB Daryl Washington ( Sr )
MLB Tanner Brock ( Fresh )
CB Rafael Priest ( Sr )
CB Nick Sanders ( Sr )
SS Marcus Jackson ( Sr )
WS Malcolm Williams ( Jr )
FS Tejay Johnson ( Jr )


TCU Starting Line up 2010:


Offense
QB Andy Dalton ( Sr )
RB Matthew Tucker ( Soph )
WR Antoine Hicks ( Jr )
WR Jimmy Young ( Sr )
WR Jeremy Kerley ( Sr ) ( Bart Johnson ( Sr ) is now listed as 2cnd strng )
TE Evan Frosch ( Sr )
C Jake Kirkpatrick ( Sr )
RG Josh Vernon ( Sr )
LG Kyle Dooley ( Jr )
RT John Woolridge (rFresh )
LT Marcus Cannon ( Sr ) ( previous RG Zach Roth ( Sr ) is listed as 2cnd strng )

Special Teams
K Ross Evans ( Jr )
P Anson Kelton ( Jr )

Defense
DE Braylon Broughton ( Jr )
DE Wayne Daniels ( Sr ) ( moved from DT )
DT Cory Grant ( Sr )
NT Kelly Griffin ( Sr )
SLB Tanner Brock ( Soph ) ( moved from Middle Line Backer )
MLB Tank Carder ( Jr )
CB Greg McCoy ( Jr )
CB Jason Teague ( Sr ) ( previous WS Malcolm Williams ( Sr ) listed as 2cnd strng )
SS Tyler Luttrell ( Sr )
WS Alex Ibiloye ( Sr )
FS Tejay Johnson ( Sr )


<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

It would seem that TCU had the most change over, with new defensive players.


However, in contrast;

The last team to beat TCU was Boise State ... 2009 season Fiesta Bowl
The last team to beat Boise State was TCU ... 2008 season Poinsettia Bowl

Also to note: if more games played can be a contributing factor, as mention in above replies, then a glance at Boise States schedule shows that Boise's 14 - 0 record saw them winning 13 regular season games last year, whereas Boise State plays 12 regular season games this year.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

You may draw on your own conclusions from this information , as, I seem to have to post that I am just relaying these facts, and do not denote any personal opinion from them.

If I do not type that previous line, a few sensitive members unjustifiably assume I am insinuating something I have not included.

.

.

.

What earthly conclusion can you draw from this? Two teams...both undefeated until the moment of truth....is change good or bad....it is irrelevant in this case..that is my conclusion.....and I would be interested in your indictment of "sensitive posters"....I will give trade your for mine of the paranoid posters.

[Spence]

The point is that both teams are basically the same team from last year. I'm the one that started this.