Week 7 Predicted Upsets

[donovan]

I think to find out what is wrong we need to have a discussion about why coaches live in mansions and players can't afford rent while going to school.

I think, in fact, that summarizes the situation very well.

[billybud]

Well hell...why don't we discuss why a law school dean had a Hattera 52 while a young law school student was near starving?

Or why a Fortune 500 exec makes a $20 million bonus while his workers are stretching to pay the bills at the end of the month.

Or why some biblical author saw this whining as enough of a contemporary problem 2000 years ago to write a "workers in the vineyard" parable.

[Spence]

Well hell...why don't we discuss why a law school dean had a Hattera 52 while a young law school student was near starving?

Or why a Fortune 500 exec makes a $20 million bonus while his workers are stretching to pay the bills at the end of the month.

Or why some biblical author saw this whining as enough of a contemporary problem 2000 years ago to write a "workers in the vineyard" parable.

The law schools student wasn't generating millions in revenue to the school.

[billybud]

Soooo?

The law school student, along with all of the other students are responsible for the millions and millions of dollars in funding....far beyond the paltry dollars coming from athletics.

The research students at a major program are contributing to $500 million dollar research budgets...

Just because one is "show business" does not change the situation.

[billybud]

Call it dues paid in the preparation for life...

Some guys will make millions in the NFL...others will just be teachers, business owners, coaches, etc.

Saban and Jimbo played ball while poor West Virginia boys....

I, myself, was once a $90 a month PFC in the giant military-industrial compex that put millions into the hands of American shareholders as war dollars boosted the economy.

[donovan]

Well hell...why don't we discuss why a law school dean had a Hattera 52 while a young law school student was near starving?

Or why a Fortune 500 exec makes a $20 million bonus while his workers are stretching to pay the bills at the end of the month.

Or why some biblical author saw this whining as enough of a contemporary problem 2000 years ago to write a "workers in the vineyard" parable.

First and foremost, I have never won a debate with you over the past years, although I have tired, and I do not think this will be an exception. This does, however, lower you SOD (Strength of Debate schedule.)

1. The fact there are justices and injustices elsewhere in the world does not make the subject we are discussing just or unjust. It is the old mother's wisdom "If everyone else Donnie is jumping off the bridge does that me your are going to jump too?" (And most of us remember a smart aleck answer would bring patriarchal wrath making Armageddon seem mild.)

2. Law Professors are paid what they are because their salary must be competitive with those on the outside. They are paid to teach the law to their students. This is not at all what football coaches do.

3. They are paid their wage not to teach football, but because they develop a program that brings in obscene amounts of money. Assistants, paid varying amounts, teach the football. The Idaho legislature had to pass a bill so Petersen could be paid more than the Governor. (Incidentally he donated back one million dollars to Boise last year for buildings unrelated to sports...his comment once, I can't spend all that money.)

4. State schools are different than private colleges and universities...Private schools can do what they want. (Why they would join the NCAA and take away their sovereignty is a question for later.)

5. No one is looking for anything more than students be free agents and schools not bound by autocratic rules that enrich the few and enslaves the masses. I say, unite athletes, you have nothing to loose but your chains....Ok..I got a little carried away. The point is, it is not unreasonable that all school expenses be covered by the university when the program merits it and there is a willingness to do it. That would be true competition rather than the monopoly of the NCAA. Be it therefore resolved: That the NCAA be covered by the 1890 Sherman Anti-Trust act...along with labor unions!

[Spence]

I'm not a bug fan of the NCAA exploiting these kids Image and not letting them do the same. The original argument was "should college athletes be paid for playing ball." I say no. They trade a chance for an education to play. But if they are going to use the ahletes image to sell jerseys and games, the players should be paid for that. The NCAA is using "amateur status" to keep these kids from using their image, but they have no problem selling their jerseys. They were selling Terrelle Pryors jersey (Ohio State #2) while he was on suspension for selling tattoos for money or whatever he got. What is the difference? Except that the NCAA is a giant hypocrite. Rules are rules, but even the people who make the rules should be made to follow them. That goes for congress too. I'm tired of the people making the rules not following them.

[billybud]

Well hell...why don't we discuss why a law school dean had a Hattera 52 while a young law school student was near starving?

Or why a Fortune 500 exec makes a $20 million bonus while his workers are stretching to pay the bills at the end of the month.

Or why some biblical author saw this whining as enough of a contemporary problem 2000 years ago to write a "workers in the vineyard" parable.

First and foremost, I have never won a debate with you over the past years, although I have tired, and I do not think this will be an exception. This does, however, lower you SOD (Strength of Debate schedule.)

1. The fact there are justices and injustices elsewhere in the world does not make the subject we are discussing just or unjust. It is the old mother's wisdom "If everyone else Donnie is jumping off the bridge does that me your are going to jump too?" (And most of us remember a smart aleck answer would bring patriarchal wrath making Armageddon seem mild.)

2. Law Professors are paid what they are because their salary must be competitive with those on the outside. They are paid to teach the law to their students. This is not at all what football coaches do.

3. They are paid their wage not to teach football, but because they develop a program that brings in obscene amounts of money. Assistants, paid varying amounts, teach the football. The Idaho legislature had to pass a bill so Petersen could be paid more than the Governor. (Incidentally he donated back one million dollars to Boise last year for buildings unrelated to sports...his comment once, I can't spend all that money.)

4. State schools are different than private colleges and universities...Private schools can do what they want. (Why they would join the NCAA and take away their sovereignty is a question for later.)

5. No one is looking for anything more than students be free agents and schools not bound by autocratic rules that enrich the few and enslaves the masses. I say, unite athletes, you have nothing to loose but your chains....Ok..I got a little carried away. The point is, it is not unreasonable that all school expenses be covered by the university when the program merits it and there is a willingness to do it. That would be true competition rather than the monopoly of the NCAA. Be it therefore resolved: That the NCAA be covered by the 1890 Sherman Anti-Trust act...along with labor unions!

The problem Donovan, is that we are all confused.

These are STUDENT ATHLETES (well, supposedly). They get education and expenses that add up to $100,000 for their football participation.

Kids strive to get selected to play college ball...nobody is forcing a kid to play.

The fact that money is generated from that play is exactly the same as that generated by a scholar/researcher...except that the kids doing overtime in the lab are generating far more.

[Spence]

Yes I agree, but if the kid in the lab makes a huge break through he gets credit for it. He at also get money for working on the project as well as the scholarship. Many get to be TA's for cash to pay for things liked room and board. Football players aren't allowed any of that. Yes, their play is being paid by an education, but if the kid in the science lab can use his name of image to make money, he gets to keep his scholarship. They don't ship him out to Battelle.

[billybud]

LOL...when is the last time you heard of a college student researcher getting paid for his image?

He/she would do better standing in line with the homeless to sell blood plasma.

[Spence]

LOL...when is the last time you heard of a college student researcher getting paid for his image?

He/she would do better standing in line with the homeless to sell blood plasma.

I said if he could sell his name or image he would be allowed. Not that someone would want to pay him for is image. The NCAA doesn't control the research department.

[Spence]

Also the student in the research lab is most likely a grad student and he is allowed to work out side of school and even in his field of study. Football players are not allowed to work at all anymore. The one thing they could do to earn money, the NCAA won't let them do because it takes money out of their pocket.

[billybud]

I think that most of us don't realize what the poor football player may receive....

http://www.holyturf.com/2011/05/footbal ... caa-rules/

[RazorHawk]

LOL...when is the last time you heard of a college student researcher getting paid for his image?

He/she would do better standing in line with the homeless to sell blood plasma.

I would think at that age, they could make more money selling sperm than plasma.

[donovan]

I think that most of us don't realize what the poor football player may receive....

http://www.holyturf.com/2011/05/footbal ... caa-rules/

New rules allow "student athletes" to work....They have access to all kinds of money and there are kinds of defenders of the present system. We get that.

Has nothing to do with the reality of what goes on.